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Thread: height of shill bidding on Flippa

  1. #21
    Administrator Clinton is a Premium Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas View Post
    He seems like a clever guy. As he provides sites that seem to be decent (and is clearly a good marketer) it's tough for Flippa to ban him. They know he will cause a lot of public issues (to his 28k fake Twitter followers). Proving he is 100% shill bidding is difficult (like all good scams) even though all evidence is clearly against him.
    Proving? This isn't a court of law. If Flippa have sufficient suspicions they can ban him. Besides, if they do need proof, they probably already have it. I refuse to believe that a clever dick, no matter how clever, can run a shill bidding operation of this magnitude without leaving numerous clues and an unmistakable trail. Bear in mind that Flippa has a lot more information on each of those participants than we have.
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  2. #22
    aka "meathead1234" Thomas is a Premium Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clinton View Post
    Proving? This isn't a court of law. If Flippa have sufficient suspicions they can ban him. Besides, if they do need proof, they probably already have it. I refuse to believe that a clever dick, no matter how clever, can run a shill bidding operation of this magnitude without leaving numerous clues and an unmistakable trail. Bear in mind that Flippa has a lot more information on each of those participants than we have.
    It's not in their best interests to ban him (as you already mentioned) as they profit from his listing/success fees, regardless what they say in public about cleaning up the marketplace. While he is smart, in 15 minutes I put together enough evidence to add to the OP's to make it pretty clear cut. As you can see, Flippa Deal Flow (https://flippa.com/dealflow) has apparently already overtaken all brokers to become the "world's number 1 website broker", so I'm not sure why anyone would want my opinion

    I have been selling sites for far to long - I have never seen (across hundreds of my own transactions) 5 bidders all willing to pay WAY above market value for a site. I would expect the only reason they unbanned him as "he got his attorney involved" - probably enough to scare off most customer support employees.
    Last edited by Thomas; 21 March 2014 at 8:48 am.

  3. #23
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    Sometimes asking different questions about the same problem yields a change of perspective.

    Q1. What would cause the same 5 bidders to bid on every auction you place on Flippa?

    Q2. What could you do to get people to pay you thirty thousand dollars per listing without regard for the listed siteís profit?

    Q3. What benefits can you provide as a seller that would make a site worth a 1,000x multiple?

    There are a dozen brokers on this board with far more experience in due diligence, with extensive research capabilities, so I know there's more to this than the obvious. What would any of you do to increase the valuation for a site you are marketing? What is a rational site pricing multiple? I can point you to threads here where members were willing to pay 200x for a site others could only rationalize 20x for pricing. Is the price for this listing too high? For some people the answer is yes. For others?

    A1. If I am a guru known for my expertise in building blog farms, could I have a group of devoted followers bidding on every one of my listings for the opportunity to work with me?

    A2. I sell an MMO course for forty thousand dollars as an upsell to less expensive training. Anyone who buys a site from me on Flippa gets the upsell course and bonus consultation free with their purchase.

    A3. This has any number of answers, from custom consultation to bidding bonuses. As noted above, sometimes a 1,000x multiple for one buyer is a 100x multiple for another.

    Please donít construe the above as justification (or an explanation) for this sellerís actions. Iím curious about how to achieve this sellerís multiples.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas View Post
    Trying to argue he found those buyers through press releases and YouTube videos is not a particularly strong argument.
    I suppose that might depend somewhat on the content of those videos and press releases
    Last edited by KenW3; 21 March 2014 at 12:03 pm.

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  5. #24
    aka "meathead1234" Thomas is a Premium Member
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    I'm all for playing Devil's advocate, but in this case I think it's pretty clear cut. In my opinion, he is only achieving such multiples due to shill bidding. Without the social proof of other bidders, it wouldn't get anywhere. I explained how I think his process works, and I'd be surprised if I'm far wrong.

  6. #25
    Moderator Kay is a Premium Member
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    I just noticed that this one has been relisted. Current bid $150.
    https://flippa.com/3049900-establish...-books-revenue

    Does anyone know the full story of the previous listing? It ended with a bid of $31,201 after Flippa suspended/unsuspended it.
    https://flippa.com/3028875-establish...-books-revenue

    And hey! What a small world. The final comment on the closed listing is by "PremiumDomainNameSales", the seller whom FinanceGuy thinks has over-hyped his Flippa listing.
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