Question for the Techies about Wifi security

[KenW3]

Hmm, what if I was using the incognito function and it wasn't storing cookies, I never allow any finance related passwords to be stored either in browsers or software like Last pass. It's more the packets being 'sniffed' that worries me or my laptop being accessed by a malicious third party. I just don't know enough about how that happens to protect against it.

For Firesheep, it's not whether you store cookies on your computer, it's whether the site sends unencrypted ones out when you log in. The program doesn't allow access to another computer, just to an online account when another user logs in somewhere over the same Wifi net. Packet sniffers don't access computers, just a data stream. On a wireless network, any data can be read and analyzed. (More advanced analyzers (than Firesheep) are available for a fee.) Your computer is safe from being accessed remotely over any network as long as it isn't compromised (by a virus or trojan), and you have a good software firewall with an anti-virus program watching the ports.

Logging onto secure sites, such as a financial institution, is considered safer because this creates a secure channel when someone is on an insecure network. I don't trust it completely, though, so limit activity while on unknown networks. Upon returning home, for those sites I accessed from a hotel (such as checking email), I always change my passwords when I get back just to play it safe.

[Kay]

I'm really glad that JJ started this thread. We travel a lot so using WiFi from hotels etc is pretty much the norm for us. I had never realised that it could be so risky. Actually, I'd never even thought about the issue at all until I read this thread.

[grynge]

I'll tell you a "STORY" there was a young man once who lived near a rather large multinational conglomerate. This multinational conglomerate decided one day it would go wireless and lo and behold this young gentleman was able to freely access the network. For months he freeloaded off their rather exemplorary wide bandwidth, one day after he had download half of the internet he was bored so he decided to see what he could see and to his amazement there infront of him were user accounts, passwords, email address, bank details, cc numbers, and various other personal details that this rather large behemoth had conspired to store openly in their network and stupidly allow their offshore subsidiararies access as well. Of course this enterprising young man didn't think of capturing all those details.

[Dave McM]

I think the WiFi systems we've used most often have been pretty secure - although there was one instance I can remember (in a fairly upmarket hotel, I think) where I was rather shocked to be able to see the other users connected to the network. Oddly, it's the more downmarket places we stay at where I'm more confident - they run everything over a secured system.

A couple of things that would ease my mind a bit more (I hope!) would be to know:

a) How open to packet sniffing and analysis are packets transmitted through a WEP or WPA secured system?

b) Is the operator still able to analyse packets passed through a router on a WEP/WPA system?

Like JJ, I never store any bank account passwords; and like Ken, I try to minimise the amount of stuff I do on unfamiliar networks. However, I must admit to being a bit lax when it comes to other passwords. It's probably about time I changed some of them.

[grynge]

Dave
a) If the user is on the same network and the netowork is configured badly sniffing is very simple it doesn't matter what router security settings are. If on the other hand you mean outside users being able to sniff then it depends on whether or not you have passwords setup. WEP can be cracked within a small period of time WPA a lot longer and WPA2 even longer still but as with any passowrd system it is only as good as your password. Use password as your password and even totally secure networks will have trollers.

b) Any traffic on the internet can be sniffed given the right location and hardware. Using an encrypted method such as ssl/starttls will stop sniffers being able to read the packets straight up but it won't stop a sniffer from storing your packets.

The internet works on a packet system, these packet pass through sometimes only a few computers other times dozens of computers on the way from you compter to the website or email server you are connected to. Any of these computers can cache your packets to be read at any time, to minimize this using encrypted packets stops them from being able to be read easily they can still store them and view them but reading them takes longer to crack.

[JJMcClure]

Thanks for all the comments guys.

[JJMcClure]

Update.

The exhibition we're at is being held at the Messe in Frankfurt, it's a massive complex with 11 buildings and umpteen exhibition halls, and it looks like they have their IT sorted. The free wifi is on an https server and there's a VPN client that they provide that will encrypt all my IP traffic (although I haven't actually got it working yet) so all sorted, hopefully.