Avid Amiri from Internet Enterprises

[christopheravell]

Really, it all boils down to *the eye of the beholder* doesn't it? Avid is clearly not selling pop-up garbage sites, they have nice designs are in clean niches and appear to be well thought-out. Are they worth $50k? Are they worth $25? Eye of the beholder.

The last established site I sold was an ebook sales site and I sold it for over $8000. I suspect many here would have been screaming from the rooftops that an ebook site is never worth that much money. But, the buyer had an interest in the subject and liked the site philosophy and where it was headed.

*Iam251 - I really think your post though might do more harm than good. I would have listened to Avid and kept silent. A sudden, random post from (what amounts to) an anonymous user -- with so much passion and detail -- gives the appearance of a puppet show. I am NOT saying that is what is happening here, I know I have some clients that would jump in and defend me swords in hand should they feel I was attacked, but I just feel it looks suspicious.

Reading through the thread(s) my first thought would have been that Avid Amiri produces nice opportunities and that, as has happened to several of us here, he was jumped on by a population that has become jaded and cynical. I mean, just because sites pop-up on Flippa all the time that are useless and sell for under $300 doesn't mean that is all a new website is worth nowadays. I assume when you buy a website (it appears) from Avid you are also buying a well-established consultant... I hate scammers, etc but I would have looked at Avid's sites and stats and thought "I really cannot see these going for less than several thousand dollars". He is not a "Flipper".

Next time, I would advise Avid and you to refrain from jumping in with sensational rebuttal posts and instead recommend you (transparently) join the conversation in a polite manner and be understanding of other's concerns, suspicions, etc... If I were considering one of Avid's sites (Avid contact me, I might want one!) this thread would not deter me too much... People online give their opinions on everything, EXPERT is a subjective term. BUT, seeing one post of praise directly connected to Avid's IP and seeing another from someone who seems to be on puppet strings WOULD make me suspicious. NONE of us here are perfect, I am FAR FROM IT, and I am sure Avid is not perfect either. So, next time just join in the discussion. Don't attack people for their concerns and come out guns-blazing, share your experience and let people know you understand their concerns. This will serve you and Avid better in the future I believe.

Good luck.

[ADS1]

We actually know first hand of the deceptive practices of Avid Amiri and his partner Dan Urmann. The single handed worst business investment of our lives was buying an e-commerce business from Avid & his partner Dan. Avid said he was a business professor at the local college and claimed he started the e-business as a test case that just exploded with growth. They created a total fabrication. It was not his only business and it was not created that way. I have the prospectus that he posted on bizbuysell.com if any of the fourm readers want to read it. The business they sold to us was in the low six figures. Shame on us for falling for it. We got burned.

After purchasing his home furnishings e-commerce business, we recieved a tip from another website owner who had bought another of their businesses around the same time that Avid & Dan had created 3 other websites with virtually the same products uploaded as mine, similiar keywords, and hundreds of web articles and content that were duplicated and which violated our non-compete agreement. They did not disclose that dozens of BBB complaints had been received and we could not find out before we purchased because they were listed under another corporate veil. They purported to be dedicated to this one e-commerce website they sold us. They never disclosed the dozens upon dozens of other e-commerce websites they were running and operating with the intent of pumping up their search traffic and then selling them off quickly, most within 3-6 months. They do it quickly so they dont have to deal with returns and customer service issues. They build websites around Google keywords, like "Brazilian Bikinis" or "Human Hair Wigs" and often do it with .org URLs so that Gooogle gives them a high PR, write superficial content and then get their team to generate inbound links to boost ranking. Every one of these websites claims that they have been in business since 1998 and included a solar company (solarhome.org) , an Amish furniture business, a breast feeding information company, a fly fishing company, a tennis racquet and tennis shoe company, a home decor company, a fitness equipment company and others operating out of the same office That is a total sham, since many of these e-commerce drop ship businesses were built after 2006, though they all say they were started in 1998. Just look up when they registered the URLs. These guys need to be stopped once and for all.

The big secret for all potential buyers is that the Google search algorithm is always subject to change and Avid & Dan's SEO techniques are what's considered " black hat "and often get banned on Google, so you can wake up one day and lose all your traffic. We visited their "offices" in Salt Lake City, Utah, and it turns out that it was a temporary office primarily for the intent of selling their business to us. They moved 3 times in 6 months, but we should have saw recognized that as a big red flag. We were hesitant to take them to court as we had already wasted so much time & money and the thought of getting in a legal contest in Utah, was too much to handle. But we wish that we had so they would have been put out of business and not gone on to inflict such losing businesses to their many buyers. It is not suprising that someone in their office stole from them, as Avid claimed in his responses here, if true. It is not a culture of ethical behavior they create.

Avid is a good salesman, we cant deny that he should be entitled to sell anything for any value he wants. But he is clearly not an honest broker of information and he deals cards from the bottom of the deck. Where there is smoke, there is often fire. He is sleazy and indecent and we hope he & his partner Dan, if they are still together, are reprimanded & they go out of business once and for all for their unethical behavior.

Note: Please dont delete this, as we want to inform others of the situation.

[meathead1234]

The plot thickens...

[[deleted text - please see your PM - Clinton]]

[ADS1]

It all makes sense why Avid would want this forum removed, as this forum is showing up in the Google results when his name is searched. His entire enterprise is built on getting top Google results. It is the ultimate irony that this forum's top google results for his name would be something he could do nothing about.

[Clinton]

In the space of the last couple of months I've had numerous emails and PMs about Avid Amiri from people who claim to have been cheated of anywhere from a few tens of thousands to over half a million dollars.

I find it difficult to believe that every single one of them was "scammed".

I sympathise with anyone who has lost money or believes he's lost money but, with some, I'm not sure to what extent it was their own fault. You don't hand over hundreds of thousands of dollars when you know nothing of running websites, to someone you don't know, to buy a site you don't haven't a clue how to manage, in a niche you never heard of before ... and do it all without professional advice or the assistance of experts we have here. Maybe one or two would fall for some smooth sales talk but I find it difficult to believe it of everyone who PMed and emailed. Some complained that his sites were selling goods too cheap, some that goods were too expensive. There's even a complaint publicly in this thread that the buyer's site had Google ads and that it was selling goods at the manufacturer's recommended price. Surely those aren't facts that surprise you after the purchase!

I accept that some may have genuine cause for complaint but I'm not going to act as judge or jury in this case.

Further, a few sent in one liners while others had detailed emails with specifics they didn't want mentioned in public. A one line email, PM or post saying "I was scammed" isn't as convincing as a detailed email with attachments or a detailed description in a post.

If you did want to put a group together to take or defend legal action, I won't allow a public campaign on the forums. But I can't stop anyone contacting others by PM and exchanging email addresses. If you are doing that, take precautions. Forgive me if this sounds patronising, but people behind forum nicks aren't necessarily whom they claim to be. Satisfy yourself of their identity before you go giving them copies of documents you hope to use in court or otherwise compromising your case.

To those who've offered docs and proof - thanks. I may take you up on that should legal action be initiated against our forum to take this thread down. Rest assured, confidential information anyone has already sent me or that you send me in future will be treated as confidential.

One more thing. Using Avid's name in your forum nick is something I'm going to disallow particularly when combined with words like scam, scum or sucks. There seems to be an SEO intention behind such names. I've changed one name already and will be changing a couple of others. This thread is already on the first page of Google for his name. If you want to move it up the rankings you'll have to rely on off-site SEO. If you link to this thread from your Facebook page, your squidoo lens, your own website, your associatedcontent article, your StumbleUpon or other social bookmarking account or anywhere else I have no control over that and can't be held responsible for it.

[ADS1]

Just discovered 25 complaints with the Better Business Bureau in Utah for Avid Amiri's last company Two Rivers, Inc AKA Internet Enterprises. His grade is reported there as an F: His name is listed as the registered agent, that is a fact.

http://www.bbb.org/utah/business-rev...ty-ut-22170808

BBB Rating for Two Rivers LLC

Based on BBB files, Two Rivers LLC has a BBB Rating of F on ascale from A+ to F.

Reasons for this rating include:
Length of time business has been operating.
25 complaints filed against business
Failure to respond to 17 complaints filed against business.

[Avid]

I am disappointed to see the comment outlined, as these comments are just completely untrue and can be proven as such:
I taught at Gore School of Business at Westminster College where for several years in there graduate department. At no time did I ever have my students work on any of sites that I sold to buyers, nor did I ever make that claim. I am happy to go through every historical roster of students and collect testimony from each. I have had students inspired by the course build sites of their own after taking my class and sell them or keep them long terms but I have never been involved in their transactions. Also, every buyer I have dealt with is told up front that I am a web development company with various domains. Any buyer would have known this (as it is almost impossible not to see this by conducting 30 seconds of research) and because I tell any buyer this up front. No web site I have produced is the only web site I have and I consistently make that clear, in almost every communication I can remember, I make it clear that I have multiple sites (even by furnishing a link to my parent company site which explains this and where other sample domain names are even listed.) I think this post is a lie and just another attempt to damage my professional reputation. Once again, who are you? Are you a competitor? What site did you buy? I am not hiding behind a moniker and not afraid to get specific. If you bought a website from me, list the domain or contact me.
If there is a buyer who had their content duplicated or if there was a non compete that was violated please share it. I have nothing to hide. I am very sensitive to my buyers and if I have no knowledge of the contravention a non-compete or any aspect of an agreement. If this took place, I would be happy to investigate and correct at my expense if appropriate.
The first company I was involved in sold potty training products online and was established in 1998. When I purchased this company I assumed its goodwill and this one of the assets of the sale. This has been conferred to other companies I have owned. For those of you who do not understand this accounting principal feel free to contact a CPA to discuss.
We were working from an office in a building downtown. It was decided to include inventory for some of my sites as a complement to drop ship so we could offer consumers more products, so we relcoated to a part warehouse/part office location on the west side of town. This area is the warehouse district and the property included a loading bay and space for products. After a short time, employees complained that they were having to drive over an hour to access the new location and many threatened to resign given the commute. A new office space was found downtown. No sham offices were ever created. This can be easily be proved through the records.
There is no buyer who can make the claim that they “woke up one morning” and all their traffic has disappeared. This is patently untrue. In many cases, traffic continues to climb after my sites were sold. I am proud that this is the case even with hyper competitive million dollar search terms like “garden furniture” or “fitness equipment” as well as for score of niche sites.
In short, I have been doing business in the ecommerce space for quite some time. I have built some of the strongest sites on the internet that have maintained their rankings sustainably and over time. I have managed to keep these ranking “even though search ranking algorithms change” as ADS1 pointedly claims. There are no sites that have “often been banned” that I have ever been involved with and do not have a single site sold to a buyer that have ever experienced this. I don’t have an interest in arguing my point theoretically. The proof is in the sites themselves.
For someone to take pot shots from the shadows and call my search engine work “black hat” is defamatory. I am sorry this has escalated but those of you who are involved with this forum should know that I am filing a legal action against this forum for defamation in the UK and have hired a firm there. My litigation will include a request from the courts and then subpoenas for access to IP information of all of those involved in making false and defamatory claims about me. While Clinton feels he is insulated in the UK and has stated as such, the hosting reseller is located in the United States (actually here in Providence, UT) as is the company that orginates the servers (XO Communications). I will follow the appropriate legal remedies. Please know, I have made every effort to resolve these issues prior to litigation with the forum owner, and at this point through all legal means but he disagrees with my position. As noted, through your own comments this forum is designed “to put me out of business” and there are real and calculable damages. I will spend whatever time is required to legally pursue these issues.
I understand that anonymity can breed hostility. I understand that from behind the shadows of a moniker it is easy to disparage someone. Please note, however, that while you may assume short term anonymity, though it may take a few months for the lawyers to go through the necessary steps, I will go through all the appropriate legal channels and will eventually obtain the necessary information to prosecute in a manner consistent with the law. In the meantime, damages will continue to accrue and will be added to my claims.
As far as Alexjn, we have already served subpoenas to other groups where you have posted defamation and expect to have your information in the not too distant future. We both know your comments are not grounded in truth but in some fairetail that you have concocted. It is unfortunate that you have made the decisions you have to malign me but I look forward to having the courts make their own determination.
Now that my former partners name has been invoked my intuition is that he will also hire his own lawyers and pursue defamation and accusations regarding the myriad comments, “black hat seo” etc. I will let him launch his own litigation independent of my own however.
This material is not true and can be proven as such. Moreover, besides the facts that can be proven as wrong, terms like calling me “sleazy” or “unethical” are derogatory opinions, clear and immediate legal violations.
If you feel you are a previous buyer and feel like you have a site, that is not consistent with what was communicated, please contact me so we can identify what is going on and I can to help. I pride myself on the sites I have sold and the number of happy buyers I have worked with. If you interested in defamation for the sake of defamation, please know that what you are doing is damaging my professional reputation and ability to generate a livelihood. If you feel that feel regretful that you never “filed your case in Utah”, I would encourage you to do whatever is appropriate under the law to exercise your legal rights using appropriate channels. Going onto this forum however and making untrue remarks that can be proven as such is not legal or appropriate.
Please note: I would advise leaving this posting up for the benefit of your existing members.

[Clinton]

Just discovered 25 complaints with the Better Business Bureau in Utah

I believe that's already been discussed and Avid has replied to it earlier in the thread to explain the cause.

Any buyer would have known this (as it is almost impossible not to see this by conducting 30 seconds of research)

I agree. See my previous post on due diligence. It's quite possible that people this naive about internet businesses don't appreciate the nuances of running a website, don't appreciate that a rank can tank, don't understand how to value what they're buying, don't know how to do their own profit projections for the site they're buying ... and certainly don't know how to conduct due diligence on a site to see if it matches what they're looking for.

“black hat” is defamatory.

Black hat is a completely legal technique for getting search engine rankings. I use it. Everybody uses it. Buying or selling a link is blackhat. Doing a link exchange is black hat. In fact, most SEO is blackhat if you go by Google's definition. Buyers complaining of black hat techniques is further evidence of their lack of SEO understanding. If there were black hat methods used and the buyer was so resolutely against black hat, why didn't he check for BH techniques when he was buying the site?

terms like calling me “sleazy” or “unethical” are derogatory opinions, clear and immediate legal violations.

Using terminology like that actually reduces the poster's credibility to a certain extent. If you believe someone has scammed you, a reasoned explanation of what happened carries a lot more weight than pointing a finger and calling a name.

A post that includes full details of the site bought, complete with links, and details of the transaction does come across as more credible than one created by someone with just a forum nick and no "evidence". However, there seems to be a good reason why these people don't want to be identified. Many are, I understand, concerned at what they believe is your enthusiasm to launch legal action. Would you say that's unjustified? I don't believe all these posts are from one competitor trying to ruin your business. In fact, do you even have a direct competitor? I'm satisfied that there are several people behind the posts, not one. It may be that they misunderstood what they were buying, that you gave them the wrong impression, or they bought something completely unsuited to them. But they do feel hard done by.

If you feel you are a previous buyer and feel like you have a site, that is not consistent with what was communicated, please contact me so we can identify what is going on and I can to help.

Can't get fairer than that. I look forward to seeing whether anyone takes you up on that and gets back to report the outcome.

Please note: I would advise leaving this posting up for the benefit of your existing members.

I have not deleted any of your posts.

While Clinton feels he is insulated in the UK and has stated as such

I have stated no such thing. I am commited not just to doing the legally correct thing but to being fair as well. Fair not just to you but to other members too. In that spirit of fairness I couldn't divulge confidential information about members - like their IPs and email addresses - without a court order.

[christopheravell]

@Avid - Relax dude. People on the web know to take what they read with some salt. If you are really working with lawyers I find it impossible to believe they have not advised you against making posts like this.

@Clinton - Yep, I agree. Any time you try to "fake it", that IS black hat SEO. Buying links that give the appearance your site is more popular, etc... Icky, icky, stuff. Thanks for keeping fair to all -- I think Avid should see that Clinton is about keeping the forum a safe and effective one.

[Clinton]

Just an update for members of this forum to let you know about a lot of stuff happening in the background.

Avid Amiri and his company have retained a UK firm, http://www.davenportlyons.com/, to take action against me in the UK. Over the last couple of months I've had several letters from them listing grounds for action and demanding release of IPs, email addresses etc., for those who've made posts that Avid doesn't like. And the taking down of this thread.

I declined.

The last letter I had from them was dated 27th May pursuant to pre-action protocol for a defamation claim in the UK courts. They demand permanent removal of this thread, an undertaking to not ever publish any allegations against Avid or his company, an apology, compensation and legal costs. They gave me 14 days which has now expired. I suspect they realise they don't really have a case.

Avid has, further, been exploring legal options in the US and is trying various other routes.

For one, he has contacted the company where this site is hosted - Westhost - and demanded they take this site down immediately as it is in violation of the law and violation of Westhost's terms. Westhost replied that they have procedures and contacted me for an explanation first. They gave me seven days to remove the thread.

As Peter has said to me via PM, hosting companies tend to play safe. It's easier and cheaper to remove a site and lose the $10 a month than it is to hire a lawyer for a couple of hours. It's in a hosting company's best interest to choose the least aggro route.

In anticipation of this site being taken offline, I took a backup of everything earlier today (sorry the site was down for a bit while I backed up).

In the meanwhile, Avid visited Westhost in person to put more pressure on them and demanded this site be taken down.

I exchanged a couple of emails with Westhost and the person responsible there went through this whole thread. His opinion is that it was well moderated and neither in violation of US law nor in violation of their own terms. So they won't remove this thread/site without a court order and it appears there's very little chance of him getting that as ...well, there's nothing here that seems to violate US law on defamation.

This is great news from Westhost. Kudos to them for taking the time and trouble to do the right thing rather than using a convenient escape. Check them out for your hosting needs.

I've had several emails, posts and PMs of support. My thanks to all of you.

The longer this drags on, the more litigious and unreasonable Avid seems to be and the longer this thread stays in the news. I never intended this to be a battle and I have no grouse against Avid or his company.

Considering the trouble and expense Avid is going to, this thread seems to really bother him. And the last thing I want to do is antagonise anyone, even unintentionally. So I'll make him one final offer, in public here. No, I still won't take the thread down, but here's what I can do. I can create a new category in the forums that can be accessed only by members. I'll move posts critical of Avid to that category (and some other posts). I'll leave Avid's posts right here. People coming to this thread would see some posts but wouldn't be able to see the full thread or the posts critical of Avid/his company. That would be reserved for members only. SEs wouldn't be allowed to crawl it.

That's the best I can do and that offer is only on condition that Avid is completely happy with it and will make no further demands. The offer is non-negotiable.

Is that a compromise you'd be happy with, Avid? Bear in mind that I'm really bending over backwards here.