I wish there were more CCTV cameras...

[JJMcClure]

I hadn't heard of the Venus project, interesting. We may have evolved at the bottom of a gravity well and most people can't imagine not living on a planet but there's a lot of space in space. A ring of habitats circling the sun at the same distance as the Earth would be able to contain trillions of people, all within two hours communications distance of each other. The technology to do that exists right now.

Thinking bigger, we actually move out into interstellar space.

The thing is, this should be exciting even to the people hung up on trade and profit and greed, there's so much money to be made out there (which is why they've started the asteroid mining project) but most can't wrap their minds around it, it doesn't compute.

You may well be right, the ultimate problem could be privacy and commerce and if we got rid of those we wouldn't even need the cameras any more but, while we try to move in that direction, who watches the watchers?

I see it happening in a bottom-up way. We don't try to get rid of money, we make it unnecessary. We don't ban trade, we just provide enough resources that in the end trade becomes unnecessary. We provide enough living room that borders and nationalistic attitudes become redundant. Power slips away as the means to control people cease to exist. Etc Etc, until people start to change because the environmental pressures on them have changed. We don't force the change, we provide the right circumstances for it to happen.

Why would you steal if you could have whatever you wanted anyway, and after a while, having what ever you wanted would become pointless too. What stops most people being able to see this is that they can't really imagine life beyond their own lifetime.

I'm not familiar with Iain Banks' 'Culture' type society, any recommendations for books to read?

He's written a bunch of stuff and it's all a good read but it's too far ahead of where we are to be realistic or inspiring, it's just a nice thought. I thoroughly recommend Steven Baxter though, his books changed the way I see life, he gave me a longer term, larger perspective and his fiction is proper cutting edge stuff including all the latest theories in physics. Really mind blowing stories. IMO.

Have you noticed how the people to whom concepts like privacy are so important have dropped out of this conversation? As far as their concerned, we're in La La land right now, despite me being right about the asteroid mining thing.

[Chabrenas]

Ian Banks 'Culture' books: here's the list, Dave. If you read one, you'll probably end up reading all of them:

• Consider Phlebas [1987]
• The Player of Games [1988]
• Use of Weapons [1990]
• The State of the Art [1991] |
• Excession [1996]
• Inversions [1998]
• Look to Windward
• Matter [2008]
• Surface Detail [2010]

To that list, I'd add The Algebraist, which doesn't feature The Culture. And for a good example of his non-SF books, try The Crow Road.

[Kay]

Iain Banks is indeed an excellent author, I've read nearly all his books. However, it's worth being aware that he writes mainstream fiction as Iain Banks and sci-fi as Iain M Banks, so the Culture series is by Iain M Banks. It may seem like a small point but it can be an important distinction when buying a book to know whether it's mainstream fiction or sci-fi. His writing style is excellent but quite different in the two genres.

Edit - I forgot to add the link to this useful list of his books.

http://www.iain-banks.net/books/

[JJMcClure]

Edit - I forgot to add the link to this useful list of his books.

http://www.iain-banks.net/books/

I would have linked his books myself but although I mentioned the 'Culture' books, I didn't want to get sidetracked by them since they're not something I'd be willing to use to back up my position, I just like the idea of the Culture. His books are what I would consider pure sci fi, not really based either in real physics as we understand it or likelihood of what can occur since they're set 10,000 years in the future. His non-sci fi fiction is just weird.

Steven Baxter on the otherhand I would recommend to anyone who wants to broaden their perspective a little and imagine what we could do, instead of what is. I believe him to be a visionary in the same vein as Arthur C Clarke. Much of what Clarke wrote about has come to pass and now we're developing asteroid mining projects in exactly the same way that Baxter has one of his main characters doing. A billionaire with the money to build a private venture. The reality is a bunch of billionaires, but whatever, close enough.

I did provide a link to Baxter's books.

[JJMcClure]

Well..... you're not going to believe this but we got a phone call from the police today, a guy who'd been trying to contact us for a while (we've been away) to let us know that whilst reviewing some CCTV tapes, he witnessed our accident and was calling to give us the identity of the culprit. Turns out it was a bus that was trying to dodge an oncoming Tarmac lorry and clipped our car which was parked at the side of the road.

I didn't know there was CCTV coverage where the accident occurred but because of it we're going to get all the money back, and our no-claims bonus. Result! This guy wasn't who I reported the accident to, didn't even know about the report actually, he'd just seen it and because he'd want to know who did it if it had happened to his own car, he took the time to try and track us down (the Reg plate on our car was wrong but that's another story).

I promise I'm not making this up

[Nidec]

Top bloke! Good to hear it seems to have worked out okay for you

[grynge]

Well..... you're not going to believe this but we got a phone call from the police today, a guy who'd been trying to contact us for a while (we've been away) to let us know that whilst reviewing some CCTV tapes, he witnessed our accident and was calling to give us the identity of the culprit. Turns out it was a bus that was trying to dodge an oncoming Tarmac lorry and clipped our car which was parked at the side of the road.

I didn't know there was CCTV coverage where the accident occurred but because of it we're going to get all the money back, and our no-claims bonus. Result! This guy wasn't who I reported the accident to, didn't even know about the report actually, he'd just seen it and because he'd want to know who did it if it had happened to his own car, he took the time to try and track us down (the Reg plate on our car was wrong but that's another story).

I promise I'm not making this up

A very lucky break JJ, glad you won't end up out of (as much) pocket on that accident.

[JJMcClure]

Top bloke! Good to hear it seems to have worked out okay for you

Thanks

A very lucky break JJ, glad you won't end up out of (as much) pocket on that accident.

Lucky indeed in quite a few ways. Lucky that there was CCTV there (have to mention that since it's the original reason for the thread), lucky that our car was hit by someone who has insurance, and lucky that there are still people out there prepared to go well out of their way to help others. That last reason is what I'm taking away from this. I didn't speak to him when he called but when my wife told me about it I rang the guy just to say thanks.

We won't lose any money on this at all now.

[Mikl]

JJ,

Despite my earlier negative comments, I'm delighted to hear of the good outcome.

Mike

[JJMcClure]

JJ,

Despite my earlier negative comments, I'm delighted to hear of the good outcome.

Mike

Thanks Mike and not a problem with your comments, I intended to start a debate and expected plenty of people to disagree with my position Wouldn't be any fun if we all just agreed with each other would it.